new armour

[Sir Matthew]

I went back and looked at my Maille information and realized that the butted maille I was looking at was eastern from the 18th century and ceremonial in nature.  I thougth that I had read somewhere of some patches in maille being done butted, but I could be confused or it could be that it was copper riveted.  I was pretty sure that I had read some forge welding of rings being done, but again I may be mistaken.  I haven't done much with the research into Maille since I put my Tuetonic project on hold to pursue my musketeer kit.

[Sir Wolf]

wedge riveted or pin riveted will work forgot to mention that as well.

[Sir Brian]

Well I went ahead and purchased that rivetted steel Haubergeon ...I got an offer I couldn't refuse! 

Oh and Bill:

All of the mass-produced mail is innaccurate to some degree, though much of the wedge rivetted mail is "close enough for government work".
If you examine the real stuff closely, its very clearly not up to snuff, but conidering the current options and pricing its our best bet.

You were spot on there! It's flat ring, it's rivetted with alternating solid rings and is the absolute best I'll ever be able to afford or be willing to pay for but I am very happy with it! 

Here is the new steel maille along with my new spaulder harness I had made at CRF the end of last season.

[Sir Matthew]

Brian that Maille looks pretty darn nice, I'm gonna have to save up some cash and get me a set.

[Sir Edward]

Awesome! It looks really good. I'm envious.

How comfortable is it? I know it probably weighs a bit more than your previous set.

[Sir Brian]

^ Riveted Aluminum Maille shirt from June 2008. ^

^ Riveted Steel Maille shirt from April 2010. ^

I thought I’d put up a comparison photo layout. Overall the shirt is comfortable. 

The aluminum shirt is approximately 12 pounds while the steel is approximately 20. Surprisingly the eight pound difference is noticeable but not excessively so. It certainly isn’t as big of a difference I went through two years ago going from my first butted steel shirt to the riveted aluminum; i.e. 33 pounds down to 12!

So weight-wise this riveted steel shirt is in the middle but notice that I am back to wearing a waist belt to not only help distribute the weight between my shoulders and waist but also to keep sufficient slack in the shirt so I can maintain maximum mobility without the shirt binding me up from wearing just my outer sword belt. 

I like the fact that the steel shirt isn’t as ridiculously big in the sleeves compared to my aluminum, although the sleeves seemed to be a wee bit longer than I would have liked initially, but after cinching up the spaulders harness to ensure I again had enough slack for a full range of motion the sleeve length turned out to be just about right.

The shirt did come with a liberal coating of oil on it so there is that mess and SMELL to deal with. Gun oil isn’t the worst smelling stuff but it can get a wee bit rank as it gets old. Also as I was donning it for the first time a ring did get snagged on the gambeson and ended up parting and hooking itself into another section of the shirt which was a bother and a bit foreboding concerning the lauded durability of riveted steel. Ominous enough for me to consider purchasing the riveting tool and spare rings. 
http://casiberia.com/product_details.asp?id=OB2360
http://casiberia.com/product_details.asp?id=OB2339

[Sir Wolf]

wow that looks great man! good choice

[Sir Matthew]

I'm glad to see you wearing a belt with the Maille.  When I talked to Tim from Red Falcon about my idea for my Tuetonic kit, he was pretty emphatic that the only way to wear Maille was with a belt for the very reasons you are doing it: help distribute the weight of the shirt so the shoulders and back are not bearing all of it and to keep the shirt from bunching and binding when you move.  I had never thought of this before, but seeing the pic with the belt on and the shoulder harness, I can definitely see that binding and pinching would happen.

[Sir Edward]

Back when I used to wear my HEAVY butted set (14g butted galvanized rings. hauberk alone weighed 40 lbs), I found that a belt was absolutely necessary, otherwise all 40+ lbs (more with the coif's mantle) would be hanging from the shoulders. Granted, it was nowhere near being properly tailored.

I think if we had the opportunity to get truly period riveted mail, custom fitted and tailored and so on, most of the weight wouldn't be that noticeable, as it would distribute itself very well.

[Sir Wolf]

being in shape and having the right shape has all to do with it. i to must wear a belt with mine now. but a few years ago it wasn't needed. if you look at the Bayeux tapestry you don't see any weight belts either.

see here:


why the harness for the spaulders? I would either point then to your aketon/arming garment or to the hauberk itself

[Sir Brian]

Well I did point the spaulders to my aluminum habergeon which was a bit of a PITA (acronym) and it worked out well enough but locked that habergeon into a single role and timeframe, with the spaulders harness I have the option of going without the spaulders completely if I want to experiment with different timeframes and/or configurations without having the bother of removing the arming point. Besides my surcoat and gorget will keep it well hidden! 

I don’t need the weight belt per se but the old straight leg infantryman in me compels me to use every means possible to help lighten the load or make whatever load you have to hump as comfortable as possible because you never know how long you will have to hump it!  ~ For the average renfaire that's about eight hours.

[Sir Wolf]

so... Sir Edward... do i see a new full hauberk and coif in YOUR future? ehehhehe. come on Sir Brian lets coax him into it. WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE've both got a riveted mild steel one hehehehe

[Sir Brian]

Yes Sir Edward aluminum maille is SOOOO passe! Don't you want to be in vogue? All of the cool knights are wearing it this year!
(ok I've pretty much exhausted my tween girl vocabulary) 

[Sir Edward]

HAhah, well, I WAS going to order a set this week too, but I've spent way too much money recently. I need to get all of that paid off first. I also need to make sure I can get a decent coif with it, and I'm not sure how much I like the fit of the GDFB ones based on their pictures, but granted, they only have a couple of photos out there, so it's hard to tell.

Of course, there's also the part of me that wants to start whining "but I'm ALMOST done making my aluminum set!!! And I'm going to wear something else???"

[Sir Edward]

being in shape and having the right shape has all to do with it. i to must wear a belt with mine now. but a few years ago it wasn't needed. if you look at the Bayeux tapestry you don't see any weight belts either.

By "in shape", do you mean "large round shape"?   I had problems wearing that 40 lb hauberk when I was thin. The mail would hang straight down from the shoulders.