Helmet Question

[Sir Patrick]

My kit is pushing further into the mid-14th century than my sugarloaf will allow. At this point I'm guessing the armour us somewhere around 1340ish, so I want to try and stay within that decade (unless I'm off the mark). Sooo...do I go with a Pembridge great helm at this point?  Seems like a bassinet will be too far in the future. Also, coat of plates and short surcoat?

[Sir Douglas]

Bascinets would have been around at this time, though I think things like the hundskull visors came later. They seem to have evolved from the cervelliere, so by this time, some of them were still rounded and not as pointy as later bascinets.

Here's an image from 1335:


And this one, from the Luttrell Psalter, is circa 1340. He even has what looks like a visored great helm for wear over the bascinet:



I think the Pembridge-style is actually the later of the two helms, though it may have been contemporary. I'm not sure about that.

[Sir William]

I was going to say 'Pembridge ftw' but I think I will await our 14th C Mafiosi brethren to chime in; I've always had a thing for the Pembridge style helm.

[Don Jorge]

As far as I know the Pembridge helm is dated at 1370...where a sugarloaf helm would probably be 1330...bascinet's definitely were around in 1340 but it was a Klappvisor as opposed to a Houndskull.

[Sir Patrick]

I know Sir Richard Pembridge's helm dates from the 1370s, but wasn't the Black Prince's helm the same type?  If yes, he would have worn his at Crecy in 1346. FWW, I'm leaning toward a Crecy impression.

[Sir Douglas]

The thing about Pembridge's and the Black Prince's helms that I wonder is: were they made at a later date as funerary helms, or were they something they actually wore throughout their career? If they were actually used, it might be reasonable to say that the helms would have dated earlier than the 1370s.

[Sir William]

Ahhh...Crecy.  Sir Patrick, have you ever read the Archer Series, by Bernard Cornwell?  Set squarely in the timeframe of Crecy, it details the rise of a young English archer in Edward III's army.  A great read, Cornwell has a way of depicting the horrors of war in such a way as to be able to almost smell the filth and the blood, to almost see the bodies writhing in pain from being hammered, pierced, slashed or dismembered by all manner of weaponry.  I went on a tangent again; apologies.

As for the Pembridge helm, we know that it didn't come after 1370; as you'd stated, TBP's helm is much like it, if more ornate.  Probably safe to say that you could get away with wearing one if that was your desire.

[Sir Patrick]

Sir William, I loved that series!  If you haven't already checked it out, Cornwell recently added another chapter called 1356 about Poitiers.

Forgot to clarify in my OP:  I was referring to visored bassinets like a houndskull with a "pig faced"-style visor. That's too much into the time frame of kits like Sirs Nathan and Ian. To pull that off, I'd need a total overhaul.

[Sir Brian]

IMHO pinpointing a specific great helm style within a twenty year span is certainly plausible. Most especially during the wild and wonky transitional armor periods of the mid-14th century. I'd go with the Pembridge and claim 'trend setter' status! 

Oh and I'm checking out that series for sure!

[Sir Patrick]

Isn't this the same style helm. It's Sir Hans Reiter's and dates to 1350. The aventail was a later addition.

[Ian]

Sir Patrick, great helms and bascinets co-exist.  The bigger issue though is that the great helm sees less and less use in the field as the century goes on.  The Pembridge Helm would likely be a tournament helm, not a foot combat helm.  Great helms may have been used for the initial cavalry charge mid century, but there's a good chance the bascinet underneath is what saw the majority of the fighting after the great helm was discarded.

Depending on how far in to the 14th you're delving, you may want to forget a great helm and focus on an open-faced bascinet.

[Sir Matthew]

I second Sir Ian's sage advice. Klappvisor Bascinet would be your best bet as a visored field Bascinet, but I think most were likely worn without face protection to enhance visibility. That's just my opinion, though...

[Sir Patrick]

Thank you all for your advice. I think I'll start looking at klapvisors!

[Ian]

For A Crecy impression an open faced Bascinet is probably the most appropriate.

[Sir William]

Sir William, I loved that series!  If you haven't already checked it out, Cornwell recently added another chapter called 1356 about Poitiers.

I have it and read it a couple of times...felt a little rushed to me.  Still, Cornwell's at the top of his game so it was a good read.