Charles de Blois Pourpoint

[Ian]

I've just about finished up the Charles de Blois pourpoint.  I completed the arming points today for the legs.  Here's a photo timeline of the process:

The pattern book:


The pattern assembled:


The pattern cut out:


Muslin prototype:


Linen quilted sleeves:


Test fit:


Arming point inside (4 eyelets, backed with a piece of leather):


Leg suspended from the eyelets, pointed to the inside of the garment.


Demonstration of the grand assiette sleeve in operation:




The outside is constructed from heavy linen, there are two layers of cotton batting to provide some padding, and then it is quilted to the inner lining of a medium weight linen.  Everything is machine sewn with regard to the construction of the garment.  The lacing eyelets and arming point eyelets are hand-sewn using embroidery floss.  The fit is nice and snug through the abdomen and hips and provides the necessary girdling to support the leg harness from the anatomy of the mid torso instead of the shoulders.  The grand assiette sleeve is functioning properly and does not lift the leg harness when I lift my arms.  I can now ditch the separate vest pourpoint, and shed an unnecessary layer of clothing that we really have no evidence for historically.  For the time being, this is as close as I can get to a historical arming garment short of hand sewing one. 

All in all, not bad for my first sewing project!  Thanks go to the lady Tasha Dandelion Kelly for her awesome pattern that even I could understand coming at this project from the standpoint of a complete novice.  She also actively helped whenever I asked and was great to work with!  I still have a few tweaks to make, but other than that I'm pretty happy with it.

[Sir Wolf]

hey nice!!!!!!!

[Sir William]

I am most impressed, Sir. 

[Lord Dane]

Nice job Ian.

[Sir Edward]

Awesome!!! That's looking great! Nice and comfy?

[Sir James A]

Since yours is almost done, are you taking orders soon?

Very curious to know how it feels when done, with the rest of the harness on. I did the same 4-hole points for the legs on mine, maybe I'm doing something wrong.

[Ian]

Since yours is almost done, are you taking orders soon?

Very curious to know how it feels when done, with the rest of the harness on. I did the same 4-hole points for the legs on mine, maybe I'm doing something wrong.

What do you mean?  What's wrong with yours?

[B. Patricius]

Not to interrupt Sir James question, I just wanted to say your pourpoint looks great! and wanted to add an additional question for you Sir Ian, if you don't mind.

How many layers of padding did you use?  And about how thick is it?  Because I'm working on my gambeson right now, the garment over my mail, that is sleeveless.  It's over 1/4" thick with 100% cotton "Warm and Natural" batting.  Basically, one layer of muslin, followed by two layers of the batting, followed by another layer of muslin.  I can't seem to "see" the channels in it.  It looks very flat.  Either that, or I'm going nuts

Hopefully tomorrow I'll have a camera of some sorts, so if you'd like me to show you I can.

[Sir James A]

Since yours is almost done, are you taking orders soon?

Very curious to know how it feels when done, with the rest of the harness on. I did the same 4-hole points for the legs on mine, maybe I'm doing something wrong.

What do you mean?  What's wrong with yours?

Nothing really "wrong", except I prefer the pourpoint instead of just the gambeson. It seems to move more fluidly being separate pieces. It's odd, as I do my arming coat the same way, but it's unpadded and has a much shorter hemline - and I don't have any trouble with it like that (pointed inside).

There's two big differences: yours is sized to you, and mine's off the shelf; and yours is properly spiral laced, and mine is just cloth buttons. I'm quite interested to see how yours goes.

If yours works well, I might ditch the buttons and spiral lace mine, and see if that helps.

[Ian]

Not to interrupt Sir James question, I just wanted to say your pourpoint looks great! and wanted to add an additional question for you Sir Ian, if you don't mind.

How many layers of padding did you use?  And about how thick is it?  Because I'm working on my gambeson right now, the garment over my mail, that is sleeveless.  It's over 1/4" thick with 100% cotton "Warm and Natural" batting.  Basically, one layer of muslin, followed by two layers of the batting, followed by another layer of muslin.  I can't seem to "see" the channels in it.  It looks very flat.  Either that, or I'm going nuts

Hopefully tomorrow I'll have a camera of some sorts, so if you'd like me to show you I can.

My previous aketons are too padded, and I found it to be unnecessary.  The only reason in my opinion padding still exists with the style harness I wear is the cushion the maille haubergeon a little bit.  By Agincourt, the nobility had no padding at all and just wore maille voiders / skirts.  I wish it were so for the last quarter of the 14th century as well, but it's not... but I digress

This garment is only 2 layers of cotton batting.  Enough to keep the maille comfortable, but not so much that it's restrictive.  Tons of padding is not required because I everything will be covered with plate as well, with the one big exception being my back, but I don't believe a couple extra layers of padding would prevent a well aimed powerful thrust from penetrating through to my vitals anyway.  A knight should have his household men-at-arms fighting at his side, and if I'm getting stabbed in the back, either they hate me, or they're all dead, so I didn't see a need to pad up the back.

Nothing really "wrong", except I prefer the pourpoint instead of just the gambeson. It seems to move more fluidly being separate pieces. It's odd, as I do my arming coat the same way, but it's unpadded and has a much shorter hemline - and I don't have any trouble with it like that (pointed inside).

There's two big differences: yours is sized to you, and mine's off the shelf; and yours is properly spiral laced, and mine is just cloth buttons. I'm quite interested to see how yours goes.

If yours works well, I might ditch the buttons and spiral lace mine, and see if that helps.

Is it still transferring weight to your shoulders?  If that's the case it's 100% in the fitting of the gambeson in your waist/hips.  The spiral lacing and very tight tailoring is why I'm able to comfortably support the legs in this fashion.  If I tried to do it with my button up off-the-peg revival gambeson it would be very restrictive with legs hanging from it.   If it doesn't tightly girdle the waist and hips it will not support weight until it reaches the shoulders.  If I get fatter, it will not lace closed, it fits that closely.  It will still work as intended, but there would be a gap, but that's better than the alternative of it ever being too big.

[B. Patricius]

Thanks for the info Ian!  Also my lady wants a pourpoint for her kit, so it's always nice to see the evolution of padded garments from my preferred era.  I'm probably just going nutso then when it comes to mine.  I just see the channels in all the store-made ones, and in the effigies so I was worried mine wasn't up to snuff.  My kit, as a whole will only have three layers of batting total, and that's in my core.  My aketon underneath my mail will only be a single layer of padding to ease up movement.

Thanks again Sir Ian

[Sir James A]

Nothing really "wrong", except I prefer the pourpoint instead of just the gambeson. It seems to move more fluidly being separate pieces. It's odd, as I do my arming coat the same way, but it's unpadded and has a much shorter hemline - and I don't have any trouble with it like that (pointed inside).

There's two big differences: yours is sized to you, and mine's off the shelf; and yours is properly spiral laced, and mine is just cloth buttons. I'm quite interested to see how yours goes.

If yours works well, I might ditch the buttons and spiral lace mine, and see if that helps.

Is it still transferring weight to your shoulders?  If that's the case it's 100% in the fitting of the gambeson in your waist/hips.  The spiral lacing and very tight tailoring is why I'm able to comfortably support the legs in this fashion.  If I tried to do it with my button up off-the-peg revival gambeson it would be very restrictive with legs hanging from it.   If it doesn't tightly girdle the waist and hips it will not support weight until it reaches the shoulders.  If I get fatter, it will not lace closed, it fits that closely.  It will still work as intended, but there would be a gap, but that's better than the alternative of it ever being too big.

I've only worn it around the house/yard as a prototype test, so I'm not sure if it's putting all the weight on my shoulders or not. It's nothing I felt from the 15 or 20 minutes of testing. It's opposite of logical, but the gambeson can twist around at the waist, and that makes the legs more mobile, which I find less comfortable in it's floppiness. The pourpoint sits firm at the waist and doesn't move, just like yours, and makes the leg harness stay in place nicely. I have the button-up off-the-peg revival gambeson, and I'm glad to hear you say you think you'd get similar (not satisfying) results.

I agree with you on the spiral lacing. I made comments of the same in the AA thread. My arming coat is spiral laced, and has that bit of gap in the middle. I've lost weight, and now it meets completely, with just a tiny bit of slack at the bottom. I worked on the gambeson to get other people in armor for the photo shoot, but I've been trying it myself as I'll probably wear it for our VARF demos; the arming coat has no padding at all, and the padding from the gambeson should be good for taking hits and being thrown. So far I'm just cheating and using a pourpoint with it.

[Hrolfr]

Tasha did a great job on this pattern.

Sir Ian, you did a fine job on the pourpoint 

Thinking this is going to be a 'next winter' project for me.