Armets, close helms?

[Leganoth]

Trying to find a "classic knight helmet"
cant really find any real ones but heres a picture that shows exactly what i mean: http://darksoulswiki.wikispaces.com/file/view/elite_knight_helm.png/269849748/elite_knight_helm.png

Trying to find a helmet style like that

[Ian]

Armets and close helms are considered to pretty much be the same thing by a lot of historians.  Some distinguish helmets that open via cheek pieces armets and via a sliding bevor a close helm though.  They're late 15th and 16th century helmets.

Here's a standard cheek piece opening armet
http://armstreet.com/store/armor/armet-knight-helmet

An armet that doesn't totally look like garbage is going to be expensive because they're intricate in design.

Here's a much cheaper one by the same company, but it doesn't look like a historical armet at all, the proportions are way off
http://armstreet.com/store/armor/exclusive-functional-armet-combat-helm-helmet-armor

[Sir Edward]

That first armet looks great. I may have to look into one of those myself at some point. I need something a little more functional for my plate kit.

[Sir James A]

Armets/Close helms are my favorite style, and they're wildly expensive. Illusion Armoring makes one, and a couple other places who have since gone out of business. Beware the cheap ones, they look way off historically, or are low quality in general. Some armor can be had for reasonably cheap and still at good quality; an armet is a very complex piece, and not one that you can skimp on.

[Allan Senefelder]

There are several features that distinguish close helmets from armets. Armets open by two side hinged plates as Ian mentioned, close helmets open via the entire fron of the helmet swigning up on two side mounted rivets/bolts on which the visors also move. Armets, did not incorperate lower " gorget lames " , in the 15th century the defense for the neck being formed by either a maille standard and some time maille hanging from the bottom edge of the armet or by the afixing of a seperate piece of armour called a wrapper, looking something like a bevor. In the 16th century ( by the end of the first decade of the century ) the " locking armet " had developed which has a large half circular channel all the way around the bottom edge of the armet. The is was worn woth a gorget with a bit more pronounced rolled edge on the top lame of the gorget so that, when the side hinged plates were borught into place and closed vi spring pin at the chin, the channel on the bottom edge of armet, locked over the pronouned top roll of the gorget, locking them together a forming a turner similar to that seen on 16th and 17th century arms in thier upper assembly. Armets usually had a one piece visor. Close helmets, which are an advent of the 16th century have usually two or three gorget lames attached to a flange formed by the bottom edge of the bowl of the helmet front and back forming a defense for the neck. They also had thier visor broken down into two parts and upper and lower half, allowing for only the top half to be opened from the nose to the forhead, or the whole face cleared if both visors were raised.

[Ian]

From wikipedia, as Allan described, here you can see the opening cheek pieces on the Armet, and the sliding gorget/bevor pieces on the close helm.

Armet:


Close Helm: (You can also see the beginnings of 16th Century Burgonet styling in this helmet)


And my all time favorite Armet reproduction by Jeff Wasson:

[Sir Wolf]

armets are the bomb. i get to play with a macpherson armet all the time. its sooooooooo smooth

[Leganoth]

So theyre expensive pretty much lol

[Sir Wolf]

oooooh yeah.

[Leganoth]

There are several features that distinguish close helmets from armets. Armets open by two side hinged plates as Ian mentioned, close helmets open via the entire fron of the helmet swigning up on two side mounted rivets/bolts on which the visors also move. Armets, did not incorperate lower " gorget lames " , in the 15th century the defense for the neck being formed by either a maille standard and some time maille hanging from the bottom edge of the armet or by the afixing of a seperate piece of armour called a wrapper, looking something like a bevor. In the 16th century ( by the end of the first decade of the century ) the " locking armet " had developed which has a large half circular channel all the way around the bottom edge of the armet. The is was worn woth a gorget with a bit more pronounced rolled edge on the top lame of the gorget so that, when the side hinged plates were borught into place and closed vi spring pin at the chin, the channel on the bottom edge of armet, locked over the pronouned top roll of the gorget, locking them together a forming a turner similar to that seen on 16th and 17th century arms in thier upper assembly. Armets usually had a one piece visor. Close helmets, which are an advent of the 16th century have usually two or three gorget lames attached to a flange formed by the bottom edge of the bowl of the helmet front and back forming a defense for the neck. They also had thier visor broken down into two parts and upper and lower half, allowing for only the top half to be opened from the nose to the forhead, or the whole face cleared if both visors were raised.

My pigface helmet has 2 hinges to attach the face to the helmet but theres a little lock bar that goes through a hole on the face piece. The only thing i dont like about it, is its a bascinet but, to lift the visor up you have to take the pins out the side, unlock it and then it can slide up, but for some reason it doesnt want to stay in the up position

[Leganoth]

oooooh yeah.

Im kinda looking for a full helmet that matches chainmail but fits the teutonic knights

[Ian]

oooooh yeah.

Im kinda looking for a full helmet that matches chainmail but fits the teutonic knights

No offense, but you seem to be kind of all over the place with the kit you're looking to put together.  If it's a Teutonic kit you're after, give us a specific time period as well and we can narrow it down.  Close helms and armets are nowhere close to appropriate for the 14th century kit you were talking about in the other thread.  For a 14th century Teutonic, you'd be looking at something like a klappvisor bascinet like this from Via Armorari, this thing SCREAMS Teutonic order, mid 14th century:



And a little later in the century, more appropriate for the full plate harness:


Give us a time period, location to work with, and order of knights if applicable and we can point you in the right direction for sure, from arming clothes to armor and weapons, the knowledge is here, just tell us specifically what your focus is.

[Leganoth]

Lol i know im sorry i want alot . But for my teutonic set i would say, 1200-late 1400s, northern europe, teutonic order

[Ian]

Lol i know im sorry i want alot . But for my teutonic set i would say, 1200-late 1400s, northern europe, teutonic order

1200 to late 1400's is the complete progression from maille to full plate and everything in between.  Describe what you want to be wearing.

To give you some options here are some approximate ideas of what might be typical for a given time span, when we mean narrow down your interest, we're talking a span of a couple of decades, not a full or even half century:

1200 - 1300 - Maille covering virtually your whole body, steel helmet ranging in style from norman conical helms to topfhelms, think crusades

1300 - 1330ish - plate bits are starting to appear, things like simple knee cops and elbow caps over your maille.  Steel helm may be something more akin to a Great Helm at this point

1340-1360's - now we're adding more plate bits, greaves and cuisses are making appearances, more elaborate arm defenses and body protection like a coat of plates, helmets are early bascinets and klappvisors, great helms

1360's - 1400's - full plate harnesses, steel breastplates, leg harnesses and arm harnesses, bascinets (klappvisor or hundsgugel)

1400's - 1420's - Improved plate armor, now your breastplate is a full cuirass (backplate included) with fauld (skirt of steel around the hips).  Helmet is going to be something like a grand bascinet

mid 1400's - Sallets, Armets and Barbutes for helmets, plate continues to improve...

[Allan Senefelder]

Lol i know im sorry i want alot . But for my teutonic set i would say, 1200-late 1400s, northern europe, teutonic order

What Ian said, you don't want " a kit " you want multiple kits and thats not going to happen on the cheap ( actually a good single kit isn't going to be cheap ).