Coup de Groin

[Sir Edward]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qaYZI3oCfuA&NR=1[/youtube]
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[Sir Wolf]

AHHAAHHAHAHAAHAH

crotchpunt (
hmmm say it with a german accent and it sounds better

[Das Bill]

I really abhor this video. I don't want to start a flame war against ARMA, because that's not my intent, but this video is on their main site with their feature videos, supposedly as a good example of how rapier is all about "do whatever it takes to survive". If someone pulled that crap at VAF, where he was willing to injure a partner during free fencing in order to win a point, I'd kick his ass out, and he'd never be welcome back, *period*. And you can be sure Alex would back me up for doing that.

I hate that kind of BS behaviour. When you fence with a partner, you are putting their safety into your hands. You are entering an agreement with them that, while accidents happen, you are going to do your best to stay in control of yourself. Injuring a partner (not an enemy!) bad enough that he has to drop on the ground in pain is a sign that you have no right to use a sword. Its also a perfect example of what outsiders point to when they say people like us are out of their mind and are a danger to society.

Sorry for the rant.

[Sir Edward]

Sorry for the rant.

No need to apologize, I'm in 100% agreement. I'm surprised that they're using it as an example on their site. I just came across it on youtube by accident and thought someone might have been poking at them by posting it. I guess I was wrong.

Since it's highly unlikely that we'll ever go to war with obsolete weapons and require strong sword skills, I think it's safe to say that the vast majority of us enter into historical swordsmanship from a variety of other reasons, ranging from entertainment, to personal development, to historical study. And none of those require intentionally injuring your partner.

[Christian Tobler]

Yes. If someone did that to me in a sword bout, I'd consider it a genuine assault and would respond accordingly.

It's disgusting that this kind of garbage is being used promotionally.

All the best,

Christian

[Sir Edward]

No kidding, that's exactly what it is-- assault.

Not to mention the fact that it appears that the recipient in this video wasn't expecting that sort of treatment, and likely wasn't wearing a cup. It's not just a physical assault, but also an apparent violation of the understanding  between the combatants.

[Das Bill]

but also an apparent violation of the understanding  between the combatants.

And that to me is the most shameful part of it. If you want to have an "anything goes" mentality (which I think is in itself a flawed assumption, otherwise it'd be okay to throw rocks or pull out a pistol), then fine, but you'd damn well better make sure your partner is aware of this, too. Otherwise its an inexcusable betrayal of trust.

[Todd Sullivan]

Yes the said person did it at an event I hosted. An individual recently had knee surgery and said person attacked his knee, injuring him. 

We stay away from the knee and the groin.  We are working with Huntfeltz's works for fighting in harness and in his half sword there are groin attacks so needless to say it takes caution learning said techniques

[Sir Edward]

An individual recently had knee surgery and said person attacked his knee, injuring him. 

That's unconscionable, IMHO. I can't imagine anyone taking it that far. If it were life-and-death, sure, but at an event? Inexcusable.

[Sir Brian]

Yes the said person did it at an event I hosted. An individual recently had knee surgery and said person attacked his knee, injuring him. 

Yep, that kind of BS "win at all cost" attitude in anything but a genuine life and death struggle, would definately escalate it so the offending A-hole would earn a couple of 9mm rounds in the back of the head in the parking lot! 

[Sir William]

That's a bit harsh, Sir Brian...but he would definitely be the recipient of a good and decent ass whuppin after that BS.  Sorry to resurrect a long-dead thread, I'm makin my way through all of them and this in particular I found interesting.  Knowing me, I'd assume we're of the same mind - no underhanded mess; I wouldn't have taken such an action lightly, not by a long shot.

Attacking that man's injured knee knowingly- I'm surprised he wasn't set upon by a number of participants.

[Sir Edward]

No problem reviving old threads. Actually here, I think it works better on a smaller forum to continue old threads than start new ones and end up saying all the same things anyway.

But yes, when I heard that ARMA was condoning this sort of behavior, I lost a lot of respect for them. There is simply no need whatsoever to intentionally harm your partner.

[Sir William]

Agreed; none whatsoever.  I wonder if the guy who took the shot retaliated in any way; couldn't blame him myself. 

Awesome on the smaller forum deal...I hate it when large forums become so overrun w/rules that they become like work.

[SirNathanQ]

Ugh. Thats really, really, REALLY, disgusting. I suddenly just lost a fair bit of respect towards ARMA also.
I do free sparring with my friends, and we even put on demos for the local middle school. If any one of them did this I would make sure it's a looong time before a sword makes it in their hands again...
In my sparring, we use full body target (although pulled blows obviously, as we use steel blunts), grappling, throws, ect. We can get hurt, and I'm fine with that. In fact during one bout I didn't step back as much as I needed to from a blow and got a nice cut on the forehead for a few months. But I'm perfectly fine with that. We're practicing martially effective techniques with martially effective weapons (minus an edge). We're gonna get some bruises and such. But anything like that in inexcusable. I draw the line at groin shots, biting, and anything that could turn a simulated fight into a REAL one.

[Sir James A]

I wondered if this was an "official" ARMA video, since it seems to be in poor taste to even post something like that, but it is indeed on their official website - http://www.thearma.org/Videos/TPVideos.htm, near the bottom.

Absolutely uncalled for. And the thought process behind posting that video is as confusing as the video itself.

Todd, I hope said individual was dishonorably discharged for unsportsmanlike conduct.