ModernChivalry.org
Miscellaneous => The Sallyport => Topic started by: Sir Edward on 2011-08-10, 17:07:25
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Anyone here ever played the Stronghold series of castle-building strategy games?
Stronghold 3
http://www.stronghold3.com/ (http://www.stronghold3.com/)
Stronghold 3 comes out next month, and is already available for pre-order on Steam.
I've played pretty much all of the series with its spin-offs, except I think I only played about 2/3 of the way through Stronghold 1, and I never played Crusader:
http://www.fireflyworlds.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=128&Itemid=320 (http://www.fireflyworlds.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogcategory&id=128&Itemid=320)
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PC games? I don't have the processing power for most of the new ones, working with aging hardware like I am. Still, keep us posted...it sounds interesting enough.
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So far I don't think the Stronghold series has ever really needed a high power system.
The cool thing is that the entire pack of the previous games in the series (Stronghold 1, Crusader, Stronghold 2, and Legends) is only like $20 now. They're all between 5 and 10 years old now and will run on pretty ancient hardware.
Lots of cool castle-building fun and sieges. :)
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Really? Think I'll look for them on eBay...like I need more reasons to game. LOL
I spend so much time on my X360 I know my wife thinks it might be semi-permanently attached to my brainpan!
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I think I even saw the multi-pack at Best Buy not too long ago. It's one of those games that hasn't really had a direct competitor, so it keeps selling.
On Amazon for $25 apparently:
http://amzn.com/B002SKDIKE (http://amzn.com/B002SKDIKE)
The download version is $20.
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Nice...found it on eBay for about the same price. Is this anything like Age of Empires? I played the first two games and loved them, but by then, the consoles took off and after that, I only played Counterstrike online at a friend's house (we'd do it up in a lan party, hilarious to think back on now) and the odd Starcraft mission.
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I haven't played Age of Empires, so I don't know.
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Well then, let me give you the quick and dirty on it:
The AoE games are RTS games, set amidst actual historical events. Probably the biggest competitor of Sid Meier's Civilization series.
Your job is to start up civilization and lead it through the major advancements, specifically from the Dark Age through the Imperial Age (think Renaissance)- a thousand year timeframe give or take. Later games added more civilizations and other perks to the existing gameset. The civilization you choose to start (will determine what special technologies you get to unlock as you advance through the ages...the epitome of which is the Wonder. It takes a lot of resources (both human and arable, not to mention wood, stone and gold) to build and can be easily destroyed before it reaches completion. Once it does so, however, it is quite difficult to bring down, and each civilization has their own unique wonder that can only be built of certain parameters are met (generally speaking, you will have to have leveled your civilization to its zenith before you can begin).
I literally spent hundreds of hours planning and building my towns, building walls to protect said towns, planning out farming regions, housing and consumables...not to mention the number of warrior units you could train, but only if you've upgraded your barracks and equestrian (and later siege shops) centers to accomodate the newer tactics. All in all, a great franchise...and excellent background music as well.
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Cool, maybe I'll look at those too.
I took a stab at Medieval II (or was it III?) a while back, which is also RTS, with large-scale battles in the field. I liked the strategic combat, but for some reason I never really got grabbed by the campaign.
The Stronghold games are also RTS, in which you have to build up food production, harvesting of wood and stone, to build your castle structures and defenses, recruit troops, etc. But it's not civilization-scale. It has a series of missions with various goals, which involve building up a defensive position and defending it against attack, or going on the offensive against another castle. The environments change, as do the goals, with a storyline.
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That sounds pretty cool...I see it as a localization of the same concept of AoE (or Medieval, or Civ) which definitely strikes me as worthwhile to pursue. I think with AoE II: Age of Kings (set during the Middle Ages), I got caught up in the historical parts of the campaign, for instance, one of the campaign missions (depending on which campaign you chose, there are 5 I believe, ranging from Joan of Arc to Genghis Khan) dealt with escorting Frederick Barbarossa's remains to the Holy Land, complete with a horse-drawn cart, pine barrel in the back, old Fred's remains slowly decomposing. You have to negotiate Berber horseman, raiding Touregs, etc etc to infiltrate to the Sepulchre where you can lay Fred's bones to rest. Another campaign you get deals with Saladin's defence of the Holy Land. Pretty cool stuff!
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I also liked Age of Empires. I played all three.
Although I would recommend the Total War series much more over any of the medieval strategy games I've played.
IMO, nothing can beat actually watching thousands of soldiers (all of which you can zoom in on and watch fight) march at each other, and fight in actual formations. Troops will also rout, not mindlessly fight on to the death. Cavalry charges actually work (although not ridiculously well as in Battle for Middle Earth)
And troops are for the most-part, quite period. In gear, composition, and formations!
It also places you within historical scenarios, similar to Age of Empires.
And terrain actually is a major factor in battles.
It's detailed to the point where archers firing from a soldiers right will have a better chance of a kill because the shield is held in the left hand! (Moot on soldiers with 2handed weapons)
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I may take the time to play through Stronghold Crusader (spin-off from Stronghold 1). It's old, but it's the one I haven't played at all, and it re-enacts a variety of crusades events and battles. Some you can play from Saladin's side.
The main releases (Stronghold 1 & 2) are medieval fiction. No real fantasy elements, just fictional. Stronghold Legends (a spin-off from Stronghold 2) is Arthurian fantasy, and was pretty fun.
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Total War is better than all the rest, Nathan? Might have to give it a go then...my gaming's primarily tied to the X360 and PS3 but I do love a good RTS and you can only get the good ones for the PC.
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how can you never have played the AOE games?
i think i have crusader somewhere but i cant find the disk
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If he never played them it is because you failed to mention them to him. lol
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I used to play the original for hours on end plus Stronghold Crusader. Thats actually what got me interested in the crusades.
When it came to the Total War series I played Rome the most, often with mods. When it comes to Medieval 2, Broken Crescent was pretty good too, best mod I played for that series actually. The original was OK I actually did enjoy it but trying to go back to it was just... blah.
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Yes, I highly endorse the Total War games.
The absolute realism is unparalleled.
For instance, as fun as it may be, you can't build friggin walls in the middle of a raging battle. But in the Total war series, you can fight on them.
Here's the website http://www.totalwar.com/medieval2 (http://www.totalwar.com/medieval2)
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I played a looooootttttt of AOE2:AOK 'back in the day'. I have Stronghold 1, but I could never manage to make it very far with it. I have too much tendency to build up a small army and go forth and pillage, whilst my own town gets burned to the ground as my soldiers happily slice and spear things, completely oblivious.
The big draw for me on AOE was multiplayer. I'd play with a friend and we'd 2 vs 6 the computer. Frantically pressing keys and clicking things for 45 minutes to finally take down the first enemy of 6 is a gratifying feeling, second only to killing off all our own townspeople in the final crusade to bulk up armies of 75 soldiers each before double-teaming and crushing the final opponent.
And then start from scratch and spend another 3 hours doing the same thing!
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Sir Nathan, in AoE2:AoK you could build walls while you fought...in fact, I used to keep 3 or 4 townsfolk roving about the map repairing the odd guard tower, gate or wall that had been attacked by enemy forces. Of course, the enemy archers could target my townsfolk but that was ok...I'd send them in to garrison the nearest interior building for safety. It didn't happen often...I used to space guard towers within seeing distance (having that far eye unlocked ability so that all townfolk and buildings see +2 was frustrating to enemies attempting to sneak me) and have'm filled to the rafters with archers and fire arrows!
Sir James...you're a man after my own heart...I never had anyone to play with, so I used to go 1 vs 3 or 4, pop limit 200 and depending on my mood, I may or may not turn off the limiter - so that all tech was available to all opponents. Sometimes I'd just pick random for my computer opponents but I'd always choose the Britons or the Franks...I'd field two companies of longbowmen and use them to flank enemy formations.
I'd usually go with 30 villagers, 40 infantry, 40 archers/arbalesters, 40 mounted knights, 20 mounted archers (great for harrassing enemy townsfolk lol) and 30 siege machines. I rarely ever got to have that many siege engines so invariably I'd end up with more mounted fighters.
There was also a cheat you could enter in the interface that would give you a Dodge Viper with rapid fire lead shot, so you had destructive firepower and speed...I would have about 20 of those as one formation zooming all over the map wreaking havoc on enemy buildings...but that got old, that is like god mode you know?
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Yes, I know. I have all the Age of Empires games.
But in a real battle you wouldn't be able to build stone walls while it's raging around your ears!
The Total War series are the best if you want absolute realism. Hint, there's no population limit!
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No pop limit? Color me interested then...that was my only dislike of AoE...the pop limit. I wanted to field 100 knights on horseback but in order to do that, well you know...it would've sucked having to cut back on everything else just for that.
Pikemen, archers and arbalesters were the bane of the mounted knight in that game.
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The amount of Troops is only dictated by the 20 unit max for an army (a unit can range from 30-75 men)
You can have multiple armies fighting in one battle, so it's not uncommon to have literally thousands of soldiers in a single engagement.
In the Total War games, the bane of the knight is spear and pikemen, and crossbowmen. Their armour is often too good for most missiles to kill them outright. Spearmen absolutely shred cavalry though.
In the Total war games, knights are not to be hastily wasted in a protracted melee. Used correctly, the charge is devastating. That's what they are best used for.
But mapwise there is literaly no population limit of any sort. (but beware, armies require monetary upkeep!)
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I've played stronghold 1 & 2, and currently playing stronghold kingdoms. 3 looks to be promising may have to look into it.
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I enjoyed Stronghold Kingdoms, but I stopped playing when the beta ended because it just required way too much micro-management. I'd have to log in for 30 or more minutes, several times a day, to make sure I didn't lose any resources and to keep construction and trade flowing. It was too demanding on my schedule.
Lord of Ultima is a similar online town-building persistent-world, but it's easier to mitigate micromanagement, and manage time. I can queue up a bunch of stuff and not log in for 24 hours if I want.
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Yeah I agree that kingdoms is alot more time consuming, apparently kingdoms is totally free now.
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No pop limit?
The pop limit was a way to keep the game from locking up on lower end systems. A RTS with 8 players @ 500+ individual units @ high resolution was well beyond the capability of the early single-core systems. It was also a way to prevent people "cheating" by having an overpowered system and lagging opponents into submission by having too many units. :)
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That makes sense...especially the bit about early systems. I stopped trying to keep up with PC games after Counterstrike...which I absolutely LOVED, but hated the cheaters on that thing. Rabid little snotgobblers.
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My favorite is stronghold crusader which i still play :)
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Stronghold 3 was released yesterday, and I got a chance to play it a bit last night. I don't know how the previous launches went, but this one is a little buggy. I love the new 3D system. And they've taken out some of the "feature bloat" that ended up in SH2 (crime and disease systems). They've changed the way some things work, added physics and so on.
But in some ways it just lacks some of the polish you expect on a game these days.
They're already working on patches, so I'm hopeful it'll improve. But in any case, the game is still fun so far.
Here's a scathing review: http://www.rtsguru.com/game/299/features/230/Stronghold-3-Review.html (http://www.rtsguru.com/game/299/features/230/Stronghold-3-Review.html)
And one that is more mixed: http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/10/26/wot-i-think-stronghold-3/ (http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2011/10/26/wot-i-think-stronghold-3/)