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Main => The Armoury => Topic started by: Sir Ulrich on 2013-01-08, 23:36:18
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Well I bit the bullet and bought a new hauberk wedge riveted with solid links. Unfortunately it came SOAKED in oil. I am not sure how to remove it, sure I CAN try wiping it, but I am allergic to the oil and I keep sneezing non stop because of it. I HAVE to remove it, but I am NOT going to use soap and water because I don't want it to rust. Would denatured alcohol or acetone work to remove the oil without rust? I do like the solid link combo with it though, it makes it feel more studier, it also glides a LOT easier than my other hauberk and doesn't lock or catch together like my old hauberk did. Also dont notice any missing rivets yet.
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What will you use instead to keep it rust free? Something like the period solution of beeswax and olive oil or gun oil?
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I have no clue in all honesty, my old maille didnt need that cause it was blackened already which protected it from rust. I am thinking of coating it in some natural oil and setting it on fire to blacken it so it looks more period.
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Blueings not hard with a bit of work & an oven.
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Sawdust and a bag, and tumble it around. If the sawdust comes out wet, add more sawdust until it stays dry.
Or if you're planning to burn & blacken it, maybe just do that with the oil that is on it already. No idea if you'd still be allergic if it's burned off.
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That's interesting...it would be worth finding out what oil they coated it in so you know to avoid it in the future. Of course, it could also be something else entirely- for instance, if you're allergic to cats, and you bought this from someone who has a lot of cats and isn't very hygienic about it, you might have a reaction to whatever dander's gotten on it. Oil catches lots of stuff.
Congrats on your new acquisition, by the way.
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Yeah, it really depends on what they used. If it's a petroleum based oil or grease, it'll loosen up in a typical solvent such as acetone, mineral oil, or even paint thinner (or gasoline or kerosene, but please don't use those). You can soak the whole hauberk in a bucket and slosh some of the stuff around, and rub it down with paper towels and the like. You might want to use rubber gloves for this. I had to do this once for one of mine. If you do this, use a bucket you don't mind trashing, especially since the safest way to dispose of the acetone/thinner is to let it evaporate.
The sawdust idea is a really good one. It'll still leave a small amount on the armor of course, but that will sort of disappear on its own if you wear it. Evaporation will get the remaining coating, which will be aided by movement.
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Yeah, I actually like the quality of this maille better than my old one, it never freezes up like my old one. I am thinking of trying denatured alcohol to clean it as that would just simply evaporate and I wouldnt have to dry it off myself. I have no clue where to get sawdust in a large quantity but I do got a bunch of solvents mainly mineral spirits in my father's basement, just need a bucket to soak it in. I plan to coat it with olive oil and beeswax afterward, similar to how my coif is.
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I used what I had in the cement mixer trying to clean/polish my mail (which was less than satisfactory), so I don't have any extra. If there is any lumber mill or wood facility near you, they should have plenty and gladly give it away.
Forgot to mention if you have an air compressor, blasting it off or dry with an air hose works okay. It's not great, but it'll work in a pinch.
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Ulrich, if you're set on trying different methods, be sure to test on a piece of maille that's not going to be front and center; like lower back hem or something like that. Let us know how it goes...oh, and from where did you get your hauberk?
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fear not... it will rust. but dont freak cause it will come off. my forth armoury hauberk rusted red once, i put it in a burlap sack with sand and it came clean.
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I got it at Kult of Athena, heres a pic of it
(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash3/540920_10200376375315247_2072932562_n.jpg)
As you can see it's soaked in oil. I think I'm gonna wipe some of it off and use some industrial soap to wash the rest off. Then I might seal it with beeswax or something to stop it from rusting. It's also MUCH larger in size than my old hauberk, prolly would make it easier to put on in all honesty.
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The nature of a hauberk, that is, thousands of rings with a very large combined surface area and being made of mild steel means you're going to see rust at some point. Beeswax may not be the move to make as it can also seal in any moisture still lingering from the washing you plan on giving it.
I have to go with the others, sand or sawdust, in a barrel and roll it about for a while. It'll be good exercise as well.
KoA, huh? I'm not able to see that site, what did they hit you for w/regard to cost? I really like that look...much more historical looking that my 'bright maille'. :)
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I've never had any issues using a bucket of water with a lot of simple green in it to cut the grease off of there. With it being mild steel you just have to make sure to dry it quickly afterwards, and the oven surely won't hurt.
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That green stuff is the oil?? The haubergon I got from KOA right before Days of Knights was oily, but a "normal" yellowish/light brown color. It was coated, but not "clumpy" like that. Mine is pin riveted, no idea if that makes a difference, but probably both from the same place; I believe mine was GDFB thru KOA.
I saw the FB post, I agree, you'll definitely want to get that all cleaned off before putting it on with the arming clothes. Having stuff on the arming clothes you're allergic too would be quite unpleasant.
I like the simple green & bucket idea. I may try that with mine this weekend. If you try it, let us know how it goes.
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I am going to Home Depot today to pick some simple green up to clean off this hauberk. One thing I DID notice is the sleeves taper ever so slightly and it goes down PAST my knees and it's also a larger size. How long should I soak it?
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About an hour, then check if it's clean, if it's not, give it another 15 min and check it again. If it's not coming clean well, try to rub / shake it a bit in the simple green & water or wipe it off with a cloth while still soaking. Once it's clean, make sure it's really dried well. The oven thing is a good idea. Tons of tiny crevices in every rivet for moisture to hide and start to rust from. Once dry, oil it with whatever you can use that won't give you allergic reactions; RemOil is at Walmart and has been working well for me.
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I had to clean it by hand because it wasnt working as well as I had expected. My hands are dry and raw from the abrasion and I noticed some rivets came out but they werent even set properly (IE smooshed) now to find a source for wedge rivets and a riveting tool. Thankfully I got it all clean and I threw it in the oven for an hour on 200 degrees, hopefully that will dry it. I'm hesitant to put oil on it because I dont like greasy maille. Any other viable options for rust protection? I was thinking floor polish but that would take a bit of work. Oil is just annoying and messy.
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(https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-snc6/429000_10200400941849395_585735566_n.jpg)
Got it clean and dried, this is how it fits me, I like it a LOT better than my old one. Only issue is the sleeves being too baggy which I gotta remedy via tailoring. Around the chest it's a bit loose but it fits better than my old one by far and didnt tear ANY threads on my gambeson AT ALL, as I expected. I much prefer this maille to my older stuff. Did notice a few rivets came out while washing it, I just gotta get wedge riveted rings and a tool now, thats going to be hard...
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:)
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Too bad washing maille doesn't shrink it slightly to fit properly too. LOL ;D
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IceFalcon or KOA should have wedge riveting tongs. You can also check with Lone Wolf Chainmail; I recently got a set of pliers from him ($25?) and it comes with 200 rings and [bond voice] rivets, wedge rivets [/bond]. They're pretty good, padded grips, very modern looking pliers of course, but functionally work great and not as uncomfortable as the other IceFalcon ones I have. Got them to do some brass trim rings, which are apparently only available as wedge rivets... but I digress... let me know if you can't find his contact info, I contacted him through the ArmourArchive
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Yeah it was a pain to wash, I spent at least 4 hours doing it by hand. Actually am still sore from it. Should I cut a horseman's slit in the front and back? Also debating on oiling it, but it hasnt rusted yet cept a small patch which I am not even sure if it was there beforehand, it's so thin that I can scrape it with my fingernail and it's gone.
Yeah I would like his contact info, I kinda need it because I dont want to modify it until I got wedge riveted rings. Icefalcon doesnt offer the kind I want.
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His screen name is "LWCM" on ArmourArchive, shoot him a PM
Fresh rust will be thin like that
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Ulrich, it looks good on you, man. I'd cut the slit in front and back (did it for mine, makes walking and sitting easier too, less like a skirt) whether or not you plan on riding in it.
Here's the thing about mild steel- it requires upkeep. Remember that thing I was telling you about surface rust? Well there's a whole helluva lot more surface area on a hauberk than there is on a breastplate or cuirass- so keeping your maille oiled is actually the best practice to pursue. If you find it to be too much of a hassle, then you'll eventually want to upgrade to a stainless hauberk as those are pretty rust resistant, or so I'm told. I've not had any rust issues with mine, which I'm told is galvanized steel. YMMV.
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Stainless is very rust resistant. Haven't had a single spot on my fauld, and I haven't cleaned or oiled it once since I got it, yet, worn it at least 10 times or so, half of those covered in sweat.
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I've had my galvy hauberk for at least 3 years now and have worn it over a dozen times, sweat always occurs- not a single spot of rust. Now, when I'd sold it, the guy who bought it decided to 'test' it and cut off a small segment and steeped it in moisture and what have you and it rusted according to him. Has not been my experience so as I'd said before, your mileage may vary.
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the guy who bought it decided to 'test' it and cut off a small segment and steeped it in moisture and what have you and it rusted according to him
Perhaps tell him about the difference between use and abuse? Even stainless steel will rust if you leave it covered in moisture for long enough. That's where "stainless" comes from ... it simply "stains" (rusts) "less".
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I need alternatives to oiling it. Oil is a pain and leaves a mess making wearing my maille impractical because my parents will bitch me out about it being messy. Cant I just seal it with an oil that wont drip or run?
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Mix melted beeswax with olive oil (50/50). Then get a canvas sack you can afford to use for only one thing.
Just coat the mail in the mix, put in the bag, and toss to coat. Maintain it with regular recoating & re tossing. This is one of the methods used in period.
Or....
Get a bag put the sand in it, and toss to scrub... this will be needed often in a wet climate.
Or... use the canvas bag, and get a can of spray gun oil. Toss to coat.
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What Thorsteinn said...but basically, there is no oil that won't drip or run to some extent. The beeswax infused olive oil may run less...but it'll still run, and soak thru the canvas bag (hence the caveat that you use it only for storing your oiled hauberk). Or go stainless...which as Sir James pointed out only rusts less, not that it is proof against rust.
Another, and cheaper alternative is to go with aluminum...much lighter, and low to no maintenance (doesn't require oiling or polishing); I have a butted aluminum hauberk that has the same darkened look of steel, but less than a third of the weight. Its a Crusader hauberk too, with an integral coif, horseman's slits in front and back- and unique in that the arms end in mittens, also maille, with leather palms. Also came with maille chausses with leather soles...I was pretty surprised by it all.
Mind you, it wouldn't fit you (the arms and chausses would be too long on you) but I was just giving you an example.
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Some good suggestions were made on FB
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nope will not work. you can oil it every time you put it away or just make sure it's in a dry place. mail in itself is self cleaning. it rubs itself. the friction of the rings will scratch the metal and take off rust but also take off any oil or beeswax in areas.
i have owned the same riveted mail shirt for 12 years or so. no issues after i cleaned it when it turned orange from sweet and rain. it sits on my bedroom floor.
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His screen name is "LWCM" on ArmourArchive, shoot him a PM
Fresh rust will be thin like that
I ended up ordering some and got the rings and tool. The tool is nice but the rings are a bit too smaller diameter to match my hauberk as well as being black. But he did say they can work with GDFB rings and rivets, so I ordered some from Hanwei's site, they had them in stock and the shipping was free.