ModernChivalry.org
Main => The Round Table => Topic started by: Sir Edward on 2013-04-17, 03:09:22
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And now for something completely different. A feminist point of view that chivalry never existed:
Chivalry Never Existed: Debunking the Chivalry Myth
http://femininemystiquetwra.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/chivalry-never-existed-debunking-the-chivalry-myth/ (http://femininemystiquetwra.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/chivalry-never-existed-debunking-the-chivalry-myth/)
Discuss. :)
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femininemystiquetwra.wordpress.com is no longer available.
The authors have deleted this site.
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Probably for the better.... ;)
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Oh very clever Sir Edward! You posted a link to a website that opposes the concept of chivalry yet the site does not exist thereby making the clear statement that those who contest chivalry are not long for this world because chivalry will endure forever as long as one aspirant knight's heart is stout and true to the code of chivalry. Well played Sir! ;D
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lol! I had the tab open for 2 or 3 days before reading it. They must have deleted it during that time.
Yes, I meant to do that. lol :)
Google cached version:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:nqrUEyF55nEJ:femininemystiquetwra.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/chivalry-never-existed-debunking-the-chivalry-myth/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us (http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:nqrUEyF55nEJ:femininemystiquetwra.wordpress.com/2013/04/15/chivalry-never-existed-debunking-the-chivalry-myth/+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us)
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My access is blocked as I am vexed yet again by the network Nazis! :(
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Strong in the Force are you, for removed that site through will, you did ;)
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My access is blocked as I am vexed yet again by the network Nazis! :(
Apparently my chivalric juju is not as strong as Sir Brian as I was able to read the blog...
where to begin...
I must say that within her argument of how chivalry is non-existant and a farce started as a fairly good soapbox blog rant with a fair thesis and quickly lost its way from there.
I like how she only really used shipwrecks as her evidence in how chivalry does not exist. This is something I know a bit about, having served aboard ship and having been a part of a great living history group in Southern California, yes they are pirates, but good pirates. In her research on the sinking of ships, I'd like to find out the actual percentage of women onboard those ships and if any of those women survived?
Beyond that, I thought her conclusions were quite well thought out, except not that chivalry is non-existant but that she doesn't quite understand what chivalry is. I do believe, living in a small town where men wear cowboy hats and nod politely, get out of the way, and open doors for all manner of women, is very polite. But it is also chivalrous in nature.
The one part I really didn't enjoy was where she went rather sexist against her own sex and ethnocentric to boot with "what women want in men." If push came to shove, and I had to defend me and mine, I can definitely be assertive and be the worst possible type of nightmare on the impending assailant. But I'm also a softie, I'm working towards creating a horse rescue and BLM mustang training ranch, cooking, and being a "nice guy." Through my short 30 years of existence but having put a lot of miles on these bones and my soul, I can happily say to my friends that are getting continually shafted by girls because they are the 'nice guy,' "look, girls easily think a guy can be 'too nice' and then run away, a lady, she recognizes the 'nice guy' for who he really is, his skeletons, hardships, and especially his honor and truth... and then she loves him dearly."
My former master chief told me that by the way when I was having those same exact troubles. Now, although "semi-retired" and out of commission so to speak, I have a lady who loves me and a 2 year old I spend my days with because she works and I, in a normal real-world setting, cannot.
I do have to love this though, wherever this woman is, she surely enjoys her freedom of speech and it saddens me that she may have taken down her blog because of people getting upset at her rants. It's her right, as a human, not just as a woman, to do so. Beyond that, this woman who wrote this feminist rant on "chivalry never existing" I have to wonder, has she met her "nice guy" yet, and has she moved beyond the child fascinations of chivalry, knights, and princesses, to the truth: that honor, courage, and commitment, never die.
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Brother Patricius
Thank you for your comments on that blog. As I was unable to view it I will admit I was very curious as to its content.
Indeed, this person sounds as though they are angry and feeling possibly unempowered or invalidated. (has my clinical counseling training showed through yet? ;)) Often in such cases people feeling this way turn to a process called Transference - in which they load their negative feelings off onto another person or group. Sometimes Transference is born of ignorance (as in the development of bigotry/prejudice by children in an unsavory environment) and at other times it is an emotional reaction by an adult.
Feminists in particular seem to be very angry in this way. I recall that once when I was in my first year at university (centuries ago now it seems) I was physically assaulted by a woman for simply holding the door open for her. Indeed I had held the door for several women, not her in particular and while the others thanked me, this one dropped her bag, punched me really hard in the chest and basically came after me with a vengeance. During her attack she accused me of insulting her womanhood and demeaning women.
Very luckily for me a campus policeman happened to see the entire then and he hauled her off of me in fairly short order. As hitting women is not something I would ever want to do I had done my best simply to hold her off from hitting me anymore.
A most unsavory experience to be sure - and I am sure that such things as direct violence from feminists - are rare. However it is one end of the spectrum.
I still hold doors open for the Ladies by the way. I am truly one who courts danger every day ;) ;)
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I got as far as:
Because a man’s nature is violent, it is dominance to full extent.
Opening with that, well, I didn't care to read any further as I'm pretty sure I'd have minimal, if any, agreement on the rest of it...
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Feminists in particular seem to be very angry in this way. I recall that once when I was in my first year at university (centuries ago now it seems) I was physically assaulted by a woman for simply holding the door open for her. Indeed I had held the door for several women, not her in particular and while the others thanked me, this one dropped her bag, punched me really hard in the chest and basically came after me with a vengeance. During her attack she accused me of insulting her womanhood and demeaning women.
Very luckily for me a campus policeman happened to see the entire then and he hauled her off of me in fairly short order. As hitting women is not something I would ever want to do I had done my best simply to hold her off from hitting me anymore.
A most unsavory experience to be sure - and I am sure that such things as direct violence from feminists - are rare. However it is one end of the spectrum.
I still hold doors open for the Ladies by the way. I am truly one who courts danger every day ;) ;)
Corvus,
I know how you feel. It's sad to say the "college life" hasn't changed. I've been assaulted more in the past four years of being at university than I feel like I had my whole time in the military, training included! One good friend, was a ROTC cadet and got spit on by someone, I grabbed him by the shoulders and yelled "Cadet! Your future is ahead of you, I already had the privilege. Let me have this honor." By the time I turned around the whole group of war protesters had ran. One tripped and fell, tried to blame me, luckily a campus officer saw the whole thing. He's a Marine as well, told me "I'd a let you trip them."
But yes, I too, live a dangerous life. Staying at home, collecting a disability check, watching the two-year old because Mom found a full-time job before me. Saddest part, people see me, fairly healthy, 30 and call me lazy without asking why I can't get up and down stairs easily.
Very similar to transference, I wonder when it just goes to plain selfishness and "I can do no wrong, for I am perfect and special."
I've always had an "internal locust of control" which I feel most people on this forum have as well, whether they realize it or not. Couldn't be more eloquently put than Mr. Henley,
"I am the keeper of my fate, I am the captain of my soul."
It is sad. So many people now just easily blame others, enjoy google and wikipedia, and then blame the teacher/mentor/assistant for their bad grades or any other poor thing going their way.
I got as far as:
Because a man’s nature is violent, it is dominance to full extent.
Opening with that, well, I didn't care to read any further as I'm pretty sure I'd have minimal, if any, agreement on the rest of it...
and yes, after that I definitely had a sour taste in my mouth. Tolerance is different than "love" as some like to say it, or "political correctness." But beyond that, I'd rather have spineless "love" than someone with that much animosity towards the other half of their race. I can't abide -centrism of any kind.
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Seems to me the spewings of artificial authority to tell others how to live coupled with tragic amounts of misinformation and angst.
The notions of man's dominant nature and how women truly desire to be "put in their place" and be dominated almost make me wonder if the whole thing was written by a very desperate man...
She is wrong on her scholarship, her conclusions from that scholarship, and her soundness of logic in further points isn't to be put into question, as it does not exist.
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Corvus,
I know how you feel. It's sad to say the "college life" hasn't changed. I've been assaulted more in the past four years of being at university than I feel like I had my whole time in the military, training included! One good friend, was a ROTC cadet and got spit on by someone, I grabbed him by the shoulders and yelled "Cadet! Your future is ahead of you, I already had the privilege. Let me have this honor." By the time I turned around the whole group of war protesters had ran. One tripped and fell, tried to blame me, luckily a campus officer saw the whole thing. He's a Marine as well, told me "I'd a let you trip them."
But yes, I too, live a dangerous life. Staying at home, collecting a disability check, watching the two-year old because Mom found a full-time job before me. Saddest part, people see me, fairly healthy, 30 and call me lazy without asking why I can't get up and down stairs easily.
I hear that bro. And you know, everyone has had a few ups and downs during their lives - myself included. Life goes on and we do what we can. Those who seek to malign you for your way of life should perhaps keep their opinions on their own business.
There is no shame but indeed great honor in being the one to raise children at home. This is the 21st century; men do it all the time and I have too. Why should the ladies get all the fun? ;)
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Sir NathanQ,
in a few short sentences you described the argument that I couldn't in a multitude of replies. Well done!
There is no shame but indeed great honor in being the one to raise children at home. This is the 21st century; men do it all the time and I have too. Why should the ladies get all the fun? ;)
I couldn't agree more.
YIS
B. Patricius
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Now that I am home and can access the blog I find myself in agreement with many of the conclusions of Corvus and B. Patricius about the woman's misdirected anger and yet I really just end up feeling sympathy for her and other women who share her mindset. Sympathy because she turned whatever negative experiences or reinforcements that she endured to set upon such a path of dejection to follow is truly regrettable but more so in that she didn't elect to search for an example of women from the middle ages who were paramount to the establishment and refinement of the nobility as a whole and a knight's chivalric endeavors. For instance, there is probably no greater matriarch of chivalric code than Eleanor of Aquitaine, who was a patron and inspiration of our Order's namesake. ;)
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Thank you Mr Patricius, effective summary is a gift I seek to use well. :)
Well spoken Sir Brian.
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I'm feeling kind of debunked myself. An Angry Orchard hard apple cider will take care of that. :) :)
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very good point Sir Brian!
I also can't help but wonder if she's read anything on Queen Elizabeth, Joan of Arc, or Grace O'Malley, or even some of the first ladies that have inspired America in its past and present. All of those ladies had strength, fortitude, and valor. All of them personifying to me, at least, knightly chivalric virtues in some cases, based on their own merits. Let alone the men that worshiped some of them. I can't help but love the "romance" in Elizabeth: The Golden Age between QE, and Sir Francis Drake, played magnificently by Clive Owen.
Lord Dane, I'm more a cap'n and coke myself ;)
Sir NathanQ - well deserved good sir!
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We all have our preference. :) A chocolate milk for Sir Nathan please. lol ;)
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Oh look, it's Lord Dane revisiting the same joke in another board, not just thread, mind you, altogether!
What a surprise!
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Oh look, it's Lord Dane revisiting the same joke in another board, not just thread, mind you, altogether!
What a surprise!
I'm full of surprises my son. :) lol The classics never get old (they just get more gray hair). Just kidding, it's the cider doing the typing. I'm on my 4th one.
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i like turtles
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i like turtles
thank you for this! :) you have no idea how much that meant to me...
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ROFLMAO ;D I'm new and don't know all the inside jokes at all, but I've been around a time or two in this and this ain't my first rodeo... I'm quite certain I have no desire to know what that turtle is used for!
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na it's all good. i like to lighten any heavy thinking with jokes. its all in fun. hehehe
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Just don't mention goats around Sir Wolf, and we'll all be fine. :)
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spiders are definitely a no-go for me. :o and I still definitely don't need to know the "why" about the goats lol
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Oh look, it's Lord Dane revisiting the same joke in another board, not just thread, mind you, altogether!
What a surprise!
(http://www.survivingcollege.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/i-see-what-you-did-there.jpg)
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Oh look, it's Lord Dane revisiting the same joke in another board, not just thread, mind you, altogether!
What a surprise!
Vader Dances to Hammer You Can't Touch This Dance: Star Wars weekends 2009 Disney (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vIRQf0S3oD0#)
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This forum needs a "like" button option on threads! I love those videos from Disneyworld. There's just something disturbingly funny watching Darth Vader dance to MC Hammer and Michael Jackson!
(https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/12489_619646314716362_1502063491_n.jpg) it's nice to see a person did this and it's nice to see that someone posted it on "book of faces" too
honor and chivalry still exists
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Well, well, well, looks like it does live on! Huzzah!